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Unread 03-19-2019, 06:52 AM  
Garan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dravik
Hello, so I've been trying for the last couple hours to get a shortcut key to work so i can tag ore nodes in the world... And I just can't figure it out. I have a hard time remembering where stuff is on the map (memory problems) so this would be a huge help to me. The alias system Is beyond unfriendly to use. I saw you posted some command lines down below but couldn't figure out what to do with them.

I've tried right clicking on the map while standing next to a node but that doesn't seem to want to work for me either, it just wants to create a pin on the map in the same location no matter where I'm standing or where I click on the map. As well as taking a long time to pick the type of pin i want to drop, name it, description, ect.

Any help would be greatly appreciated! For some reason when I asked people in-game about plugins, I'm met with borderline hostility about how i don't need plugins to play the game...

The simplest approach for you would be to use the 'quick annotation tool' that was added for exactly the point of quickly and easily keeping track of items in the game world. The tool is an icon that looks like a flag. It is transparent unless you mouse over it so that it doesn't negatively impact game play so you may not have noticed it. Its default position should be in the top left of the screen (it can be moved by either holding Alt and then dragging it to where you want it (note, Alt must be pressed and held BEFORE you move the mouse over the icon. It used to use Ctrl + drag but SSG broke the Ctrl key for plugins a while back and haven't fixed it yet). If you are having trouble moving it, you can also open the settings (click the gears in top left of map) and enter coordinates for the icon manually. The tool will use your in-game location and whatever you have currently targeted to add an icon to moormap. Note, if your location coincides with multiple maps, the annotation will be added to all maps that match. I would not recommend adding every single ore node you come across, just a small sampling so you can later recall which map that type of node spawns on - I know some people that have added literally thousands of ore nodes and displaying MoorMap now negatively impacts their game play.

Right clicking on the map will add the annotation at the location you clicked, not at the location of your character and does not attempt to determine the type of annotation for you so it is less useful for nodes, really only better for NPCs and points of interest where you might want to manually enter coordinates or a detailed description (with the quick annotation tool you'd have to add the annotation and then edit it to set a detailed description, slightly harder).

As to people complaining about plugins, it is true that plugins are not necessary. They just make some aspects of the game a little easier to handle, especially where the built-in UI is limited. Turbine/SSG purposely limited the API to prevent automation so plugins don't have much impact on gameplay other than making it easier for some users to organize and find information or keep better track of frequently used skills, particularly those that need to be used in combinations. Those of us that played back in vanilla SoA days didn't have plugins. We made do with the built-in interface enhanced by external applications like Notepad for keeping track of our own info and websites to look up info from others. We played the game just fine. When plugins were introduced, the first thing I did was write AltInventory so I could see all of my crafting alt info without task switching to notepad. Not because it was necessary, it was just a little bit easier.

Last edited by Garan : 03-19-2019 at 09:45 AM.
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Unread 03-18-2019, 10:52 PM  
Dravick
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Hello, so I've been trying for the last couple hours to get a shortcut key to work so i can tag ore nodes in the world... And I just can't figure it out. I have a hard time remembering where stuff is on the map (memory problems) so this would be a huge help to me. The alias system Is beyond unfriendly to use. I saw you posted some command lines down below but couldn't figure out what to do with them.

I've tried right clicking on the map while standing next to a node but that doesn't seem to want to work for me either, it just wants to create a pin on the map in the same location no matter where I'm standing or where I click on the map. As well as taking a long time to pick the type of pin i want to drop, name it, description, ect.

Any help would be greatly appreciated! For some reason when I asked people in-game about plugins, I'm met with borderline hostility about how i don't need plugins to play the game...
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Unread 03-16-2019, 07:35 AM  
Garan
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While running through Moria on the Legendary servers I realized there are a number of NPCs and items that the devs moved, added or removed in the last revamps. I may need to re-do all of the default annotations in Moria. Blech! (lot of work). Since a number of items and locations can only be reached when specific quests are active it will be a major pain On the good side, I finally got around to tracking down my silly math error that made interior locations harder to display so the areas I rework should include more interiors. Now I just need to figure out how to find another 8 hours in every day...
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Unread 01-31-2019, 04:47 PM  
Garan
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OK, the U23 update is finally released.

Known issues:
1) There are still a couple of Scourges from the resource instances that I haven't located - I'll add them in a later updated if I ever encounter them.

2) I included Sulferous Deposit locations for the Withered Heath resource instance before I realized their locations are semi-random and then forgot to go back and remove them before publishing. They will be gone in the next release (whenever that happens).
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Unread 01-14-2019, 09:27 PM  
Garan
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FWIW, I have not abandoned MoorMap (although the U23 update has been significantly delayed, some of you may have run into me slacking off on the Legendary servers). In fact, I was inspired by my discussion with Therzok to dig back into the implementation of the local search panel and realized I had not revisited the search filter after I changed the way that annotations are loaded. Part of that change had actually made it possible to dynamically filter the actual annotations (as opposed to just filtering the list on the search panel) via the search filter without significantly impacting performance. That functionality has now been re-implemented and will be in the next release.

So, thank you Therzok for bringing this topic up, I know this is not the functionality you were asking for, but your comments did inspire me to re-investigate this option.

I will be getting back to gathering U23 update annotation data and the next release should be out soon. Thank you for your patience

Last edited by Garan : 01-14-2019 at 09:28 PM.
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Unread 12-30-2018, 09:30 PM  
Garan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Therzok
Hey, thanks for the solid answer and sorry for my late response. Yes, it seems like I have a different use case.

Given the breeland zone:
https://i.imgur.com/6Pm83cK.png

We have 2 colors here used in my drawing, yellow and red.

I used red to mark zones and slayer deeds I have not completed yet. Since I want to complete all of them, I want to have an efficient way to tackle the problem at hand. I'm only interested in exploration markers and deed numbers while in this mode.

In example, I would like all deeds annotations and exploration markers that are _not_ in the red circles to not show up (even if that meant manually clicking them all the other deed markers to go away, since there is no API to query whether someone has completed a deed or not).

When I only see the deeds I have to do, I can trace a path to make deed completion a less ardous task, as I only have to check the deed log once to disable the deeds I'm not interested in (i.e. already done), rather than have to check over and over to see which ones I have left. Switching between MoorMap and the actual map to see what's left to do is friction.

So, I would count this as: remove things I've done from the map.

Then, we get to the yellow color. When I only see the deeds I have left to do, I can simply trace the yellow path mentally when I see only 'interesting' nodes, not everything.

On a more advanced level, it would be nice to have a button that traces a shortest path via dijkstra or the like, for you with the given visible markers.
Much of what you are looking for will not work well with the file handling available via Lua. When I first wrote MoorMap I imported the default data during each update and saved that data in user data files - I had originally intended letting users show/hide or otherwise modify the annotation data (basically what you are asking for). Unfortunately, due to inefficiencies in the underlying code that handles the user data files, this led to excessive load times when switching maps (especially the larger regional maps) and I had to scrap that mechanism for the current process that loads all of the default data from .lua files which the Lua interpreter handles far faster and more efficiently than the Turbine implementation of .plugindata files. This eliminated the delays caused by reloading while switching maps but also eliminated the ability to customize anything in the default data such as a display state. Those running off SSDs wouldn't notice as much difference (it was still perceptible but not as annoying), but it makes a huge difference to any users using a HDD for their documents folder.

The ability to show/hide individual parts of the Berry's Deed Data may be practical but I don't expect to be spending much time working on MoorMap (as previously mentioned, it has been in maintenance mode for several years as I've moved on to other projects that require my time - the plugin was written eight years ago, eons ago in software terms). Any customization would likely only persist until the user changes maps or unloads the plugin but that might suit your purpose. I'll make a note to look into this on my ToDo list but actual implementation would be a fairly low priority.

Additionally, since we have no access to the underlying terrain, automatically drawing a best or shortest path is pointless as impassable terrain can not be detected. That would mean the shortest path would often be horribly incorrect. I once toyed with the idea of using my Lua line class to allow users to create their own lines within the plugin and save them but again, inefficiencies in the plugin system (we can't actually draw lines, the line class creates thin rotated windows to simulate lines) made the process clunky at best - it would be great if SSG gave us the ability to actually save images via Lua but since the API hasn't changed appreciably since 2014 (none of the devs that implemented Lua are still with SSG) I doubt we'll ever see any significant updates to the API, certainly not something as involved as image editing.

Last edited by Garan : 12-30-2018 at 09:42 PM.
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Unread 12-30-2018, 08:44 PM  
Therzok
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Hey, thanks for the solid answer and sorry for my late response. Yes, it seems like I have a different use case.

Given the breeland zone:
https://i.imgur.com/6Pm83cK.png

We have 2 colors here used in my drawing, yellow and red.

I used red to mark zones and slayer deeds I have not completed yet. Since I want to complete all of them, I want to have an efficient way to tackle the problem at hand. I'm only interested in exploration markers and deed numbers while in this mode.

In example, I would like all deeds annotations and exploration markers that are _not_ in the red circles to not show up (even if that meant manually clicking them all the other deed markers to go away, since there is no API to query whether someone has completed a deed or not).

When I only see the deeds I have to do, I can trace a path to make deed completion a less ardous task, as I only have to check the deed log once to disable the deeds I'm not interested in (i.e. already done), rather than have to check over and over to see which ones I have left. Switching between MoorMap and the actual map to see what's left to do is friction.

So, I would count this as: remove things I've done from the map.

Then, we get to the yellow color. When I only see the deeds I have left to do, I can simply trace the yellow path mentally when I see only 'interesting' nodes, not everything.

On a more advanced level, it would be nice to have a button that traces a shortest path via dijkstra or the like, for you with the given visible markers.
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Unread 12-16-2018, 10:30 PM  
Garan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Therzok
I think I was referring to the overlay in a wrong manner, I meant individually hide each marker from the UI.
Yes, I suspect there is a miscommunication due to terminology. As used in MoorMap (and mapping in general), an overlay is quite literal, that is, a transparency laid over a map. In the case of MoorMap, a transparent image used to denote a path to an objective, a highlight of an area, etc. drawn over the image of the map. The individual marks that are actually part of MoorMap are called Annotations (just a synonym of 'mark' commonly used to reference notes or other markings on a document). Annotations usually denote a specific item, npc or location coordinate.

Deeds can often refer to things that occur in a large part of the map or at (or very near) a group of distinct locations. In the former case, Overlays are the best solution as they can be used to indicate a large area of a map in which a deed can be completed (see Berry's Deed Data overlay examples). In the latter case , which I now assume you are interested in, you are looking for one or more Annotations which might be obscured by other nearby Annotations. While there is indeed no way to hide all but a single annotation, there IS a means of temporarily highlighting either 1) a specific Annotation or 2) the location of a specific Annotation. I make the distinction because in the first case you still see all of the annotations, in the second case, you suppress some or all annotations to make the marked location easier to spot. In both cases you use the Local Search, accessed by the silver (or greyish) magnifying glass at the top of MoorMap, fourth button from the left. For instance, if you are looking for the flowers in the Old Forest deed and show the Breeland map (I know the Old Forest has it's own less cluttered map, but Breeland is used for the sake of demonstrating finding a single annotation in a larger clutter). Below is a screenshot of the Breeland map with all annotations showing: Fig 1 (click the image to see full size):
ScreenShot00375
If you click on the silver magnifying glass, it opens a panel on the right side with a filter box at the top. Type in the name (or part of name) of the annotation you are looking for - in this case I typed 'dor' to find Dorollin's Flower. The list of annotations will be reduced to those matching the typed text. Fig 2:
ScreenShot00377a
If you now click on the entry for Dorollin's Flower, a 'ping' (an animated expanding circle) is displayed at the coordinates of that annotation (look at the lower left area just above the text for Withywindle Crossing - the animated version is easier to spot) Fig 3:
ScreenShot00376
If you can't spot the animated ping, then you can use the second option which is to filter out the annotations by clicking the filter button (looks like a circle with red and green dots above a separator and just red below it), third button from the left top corner of MoorMap. I selected 'Clear All' to make the ping far more visible, you can clearly see one of the animated rings in the lower left corner (again the actual animated ping is far easier to spot). Fig 4:ScreenShot00377

FWIW, I did consider making the annotations subject to the filtering of the local search panel but testing indicated it significantly impacted the performance of the filter text box, especially on lower end systems. I also considered adding an "update filter" button to apply the filter but it just didn't seem worth the time for what was essentially very little gain in functionality over the existing functionality.
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Unread 12-16-2018, 08:18 PM  
Therzok
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I think I was referring to the overlay in a wrong manner, I meant individually hide each marker from the UI.
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Unread 12-16-2018, 08:02 PM  
Therzok
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(The idea behind the functionality is hiding deeds and parts of deeds you completed, manually, as the API does not allow to query that)
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Unread 12-16-2018, 07:56 PM  
Therzok
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I've tried looking around and I can't find any way to toggle visibility of just _one_ overlay. Let's say I'm doing deeds in one area, and I've explored all but 2 overlays. I would like to manually toggle off other overlays while I work on getting the deed for those two. I might have missed it in the UI.

Through my short read of the source code, I did not find that functionality and was wondering if you wanted me to submit a patch with that functionality implemented.
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Unread 12-15-2018, 09:40 PM  
Garan
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Re: Contribution

Quote:
Originally Posted by Therzok
Hey, mind if I contribute a patch that allows hiding/showing specific overlays? Since the API doesn't allow querying quest/deed status, maybe users manually ticking visibility of overlays or graying them out would help with deed hunting.
Hi, Thanks for your interest in MoorMap Overlays. I'm not sure what you mean by hiding/showing specific overlays. MoorMap already has the ability to have user created Overlays which can be shown/hidden individually as desired. If you mean do I mind if you create and publish Overlays for deeds, then I certainly don't mind, that's the exact reason I created the Overlay capability (and included Berry's Deed Data Overlays as examples) - for users to make and publish their own Overlays. AFAIK, the only users making use of this feature are doing so within their own kins (actually I don't think any of those kins are even playing anymore). There are instructions in the readme.txt file in the MoorMap plugin folder on how to create a .tga file with transparency and how to use that file for an Overlay in MoorMap. If you create one or more Overlays, you can then publish them here on lotrointerface.com - the easiest way is to zip them up and instruct users to unzip them to their Plugins\GaranStuff\MoorMap\Overlays folder and also include instructions on which maps the overlays are for (and probably include the text of the readme.txt that explains how to create the overlay definitions). Once published, if you wish them to be included as default overlays in a future version of MoorMap, just post again here with the name of the interface you created and a request to include them in MoorMap. I'll review them and include them (with suitable note in the credits) if they are suitable for MoorMap.

Note: IIRC, the floating 'Legend' and data driven capabilities of the Berry's Deed Data Overlays is still hardcoded and not available for user defined Overlays so if you want a Legend you will have to include it in your transparency (it's been a number of years since I implemented the Overlays so I don't recall whether user defined Legends were ever implemented - they were on the ToDo list but kept getting bumped down due to other more important updates). Since MoorMap is basically in a maintenance mode, I don't foresee any real functional changes - map updates and simple content updates such as user generated Overlays yes, new functionality, no. As evidenced by the fact that the U23 update hasn't even gotten published yet, MoorMap is unfortunately a fairly low priority right now (RL and other projects keep getting in the way).

Last edited by Garan : 12-15-2018 at 10:16 PM.
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Unread 12-15-2018, 11:50 AM  
Therzok
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Contribution

Hey, mind if I contribute a patch that allows hiding/showing specific overlays? Since the API doesn't allow querying quest/deed status, maybe users manually ticking visibility of overlays or graying them out would help with deed hunting.
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Unread 12-06-2018, 10:22 PM  
Garan
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Re: Update for The Grey Mountain

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jethpriel
Heya
I like this plugin and I am wondering if any update for The Grey Mountain is comming?
Hi. Yeah, MoorMap, TerrainMap and the LotRO Google map are all due for an update for U23. Unfortunately, I have been very busy with RL projects and haven't had time to complete the updates. I hope to have them available before the Holidays but as that is fast approaching and RL keeps interfering it may not happen until after New Years.
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Unread 12-06-2018, 07:24 PM  
Jethpriel
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Update for The Grey Mountain

Heya
I like this plugin and I am wondering if any update for The Grey Mountain is comming?

Last edited by Jethpriel : 12-06-2018 at 07:25 PM.
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